In Chapter 16, Holden states:
"The best thing, though, in that museum, was that everything always stayed right where it was. Nobody'd move...Nobody'd be different."
What does this quote reveal about Holden? What is the significance of this observation?
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I just want to be first but I haven't actually read these chapters yet but.. HAHA IM FIRST WOOOOOHOOOOOO
Pablo
It is my belief that intertwined with the quote “ Nobody ’d move...Nobody ’d be different” is Holden’s Longing for a life of simplicity. Throughout the book Holden is wanting a world where
people “don’t give a damn about their suitcases”. Meaning that Holden sees his life through a window of “depression”, a world in which others no longer feel the need of honesty. Holden though is somewhat hypocritical [ he hardly lives up to honesty which he values] , he often shows contempt for lack of kindness, listing them as phoneys or hot shots. Holden not only shows pity for himself but pity for others. Those he considers lesser are those he thinks that are doomed to a life of boredom and sorrow.
I think that holden just wants a life without complications where everything is always the same and never changes. I think that this makes Holden dull. I guess he doesn't want anyone to be different or a "phony". He even wants people to not be like himself because Holden is a "phony" which makes him a hypocrite. Holden's view of a world without complications is a perfect world for him.
This quote shows that holden wants everything in life to be normal and easy going. He does not want anyone to be different, weird, or a "phony" because he is a "phony" and wants everyone else to be little more perfect. This quote shows that holden is kind of picky as to who he likes and dislikes. Holden really wants everything to be perfect in life so that life would be much easier and not so difficult and complicated. He only wants a world that has no problems which makes a little booring because if life doent have its ups and downs, everything would be perfect but would not be interesting as it is in reality.
I agree with my classmate's responses that were posted before me on the fact that Holden longs for a life of simplicity. He remembers when he was younger and he would go to that museum and how every single time he went the statues would be in the same position and order, whereas he would have changed. I believe this shows the childish side of Holden, who yearns for the moments in his life where people were not "phonies" and Allie was still alive. He envies that the statues remain unaffected by worries that plague him day and night. The museum also appears to be a safe place to him, one where he would go every weekend and the exhibits would be the exact same than his previous visits.
Expanding on the idea that this represents Holden as a child, when he was younger life was much better. Allie was alive, his mom was mentally healthy and they where all together as a family. Contrasting now, when Holden comes close to visiting the museum that night, his little brother has perished, he has not been in recent contact with his family, and he is as confused as can be.
It is then when he recalls his visits when he was younger, and passing though the halls with his peers and teachers that he begins to wonder and that is when he thinks: "Nobody'd move...Nobody'd be different." This shows that even though Holden might appear to be mature because of his physical appearance, he yearns for his childhood days.
I feel like this quote shows how uncomfortable holden is with this sort of inconsistant life. I agree with nicholas, it does show that he longs for a life of simplicity. Holden seems almost like this bad boy, who kind of just goes with the flow. But this quote shows how he kind of wants a life with out change. It's almost like the figures in the museum that he see's in glass cases are something that he kind of depends on to stay where they are. He talks about later, how you could come back a while later and be a completely different person and it would be in the same place. These figures are almost how he wants life to be.
I guess this observation is signifigant because it shows a different side of Holden. It's almost the side that he reveals in his composition, but he longs for his life to kind of stay mellow, or almost still. I dont really blame him, he's been kicked out of multiple schools, and he has run away to NYC. The feeling that Holden has in this quote is almost that he wants to have the same ability the figures in the glass cases have and be able to have a life where challenges don't pop up, or maybe a life where things can just lay stay the same for a while.
I think Holden just wants everything to be as it used to be, when Allie was alive, when he, Allie and Phoebe used to walk in the park, as if they were like the eskimo, nothing would change. I think he wishes everything back. A world without problems, where everybody perfect, but not to perfect, beacuse that makes them "phoney", but just that everything would be normal.
I think that this quote shows holden's liking of the way things are. he doesn't really want anything to change. He shows this because he seems more comfortable in a place that he knows better. He states this in the museum. Holden isn't for change. this is why he doesn't like school. it is uncomfortable for him. Holden has to be comfortable to be happy.
HAHAHAHA pablo is beast. he was first
-Brandon
finnalllllyyy.....
I believe that this quotes shows that Holden is most comfortable with the idea of regularity. He said that the best thing about the museum is that everything always stayed the same; that nothing never moved. To him the best part is the fact that everything in this museum has a sense of consistency, and that is a reassurance to Holden because his life is rapidly changing. He enjoys stability in his life. But he has not had a very stable life considering that he has switched schools so many times. And then now, when he no longer has a school to attend, the amount of stability in his life has dwindled to a very scarce amount. This is a significant observation because the readers now get to know one thing that seems important to Holden, which is consistency.
i agree with everyone that this shows that holden wants a simple regular life without obnoxious snobs, bastards, hot shots and phonies. i also think that it represents the idea that holden also said that however you had changed phisically but nothing else had. i feel like holden is trying to say that how this museum will always be the same as it was when he was a kid befor alli died and before he wen to bording school and he wishes that when he returned to his family they would be the same too. before alli died and maybe he feels upset that he left and was out of contact with them for such a long time and that if he hadn't left his family would still be happy and they would feel whole because he was making his family feel like they had lost two kids because holden seems to be lost to the world
Holden yearns for stability in his life. He is always changing. The world around him is always changing. He is never in the same school for long. He is barely ever home because of being away at boarding school so often. He never keeps friends for very long because he is always shifting around. This museum serves as a stability in his life. I think this is also related to his hat which always looks the same on him no matter when he wears it. It also relates to Jane because her and Pheobe are the only two people in his life that are always the same to him. They always accept him for who he is because they are the only people in the world that truly love him. He could go to that museum in 1934 then again in 1974 and it would be the same. That i s important to Holden.
Pablo
I think the message that this quote is portraying is the sadness that Holden is really feeling inside. 'everything always stayed right whee it was' has this message that he felt alone in a way. I think that Holden feels lonely when he states this, 'Nobody'd move...Nobody'd be different' I hink this states that Holden does have feelings and he isn't just some rude kid that left Pencey. I think he is trying to find friends or someone to talk to. I also think that Holden feels that he is being abandoned by his friends or family, and I think that this is one reason he is in New York- to look for friends and a legitimate family he can spend time with. This shows that Holden is really nice under a blanket of 'rude'.
-EmmaFrancesa♥
Holden has very few things in his life that stay the same. He’s always changing schools and always changing the style of his life. His brother died recently and he can’t be with the only people he respects—his other siblings. When he was younger he wasn’t always getting kicked out of school. It seems like back then he got to live his life without getting in trouble constantly. Back then, it seems like things were more consistent. The museum represents something constant in this life even though he’s outgrown it. He is happy that he matured and that he doesn’t need the museum anymore, but he’s also sad he lost the only constant thing in his life.
On the other hand, he’s happy that Phoebe, his younger sister, can experience these things with for him. He’s the older generation, which is why he left the museum when he walked all the way over there. He knows that now that he’s older he needs to find a new reliable thing. Part of growing up is realizing that things can’t always stay the same, but everyone needs a constant thing in their life—it’s just that when you get older your constant thing is smaller and harder to find.
Having something constant is what is needed to save his already deteriorating life. When he was younger he wasn't in the trouble he's in now and he was able to just go on doing what he was doing, but now like everyone else he has grown up and being grown up means trying to become better which makes you worst.
This quote reveals a lot about Holden. It sort of shows how he wants a simple life because "Nobody'd move...Nobody'd be differnt" shows that the museum is simple and never changes, and Holden has a very complicated life and wants his life to be simple, because he is having a lot of problems. He liked the museum, and he is happy his 10 year old sister is getting to experience what he loved in his life, and he doesnt want her to have a complicated life he is having.
This quote resembles that Holden wants to have a life, be welcomed by his peers and be accepted. This quote talks about the still life in a museum. This shows that holden wants a ordinary life, one with out so many ups and downs, something that's calm and always happens in a fairy tale. He is very fed up with the life is living now, and something different is always happening to him. He is either in a arguement, lying, depressed, or hiding his identity. This is a difficult life for him and you can tell he wants to leave that part of him. This quote also resembles that Holden wants his life to stop for a minute and stay still so that he is the only one living so he can reflect on all the memories and bad times he's had. It's as if he wishes he could be in one of those class cases in the museum so he can get away from himself and everyone else.
I think that Holden wants the world to be the way that he wants it or the way that he thinks the world should be in his eyes at least. I think that he thinks that the world is way too comolicated and that he wishes that it weren't. I think when he said nobody'd move and everything stayed where it was, he was saying that everything in the meusem knew where it was supposed to be, that it wasn't confused and wondering like people in human life tend to be sometimes. I think that this means that people are confused about certain things in their life and they seek help and attention.
I think this shows that hold is a little bit soft and as peruana801 said it makes him look dull because maybe he isn't quite ready for the real world and being by himself due to all of the things that have happened to him.
This quote shows that holden might actually be softer then he lets on. Holden shares here that he likes the museum because it never changes, even when you change, it never does. Holden is always moving, always changing. He pretty much never stands still. Holden is always either moving to a different school or being kicked out of one. so basicly, he never stops changing, hence everything is always changing for him. He must enjoy having something thaat never changes around. He feels that life is coming at him too fast and he isnt prepared.something good comes, then it changes and its gone. something problematic comes, then it changes and it gone too. Nothing stays. So to go to this museum once when he is six and see all the people in the glass boxes there, and then coming back when he is a teenager and moving to alot of different schools with everything exactly how he remembers it, is like a sanctuary for him. its one of the few things in his life that is staying the same.
holden is saying that the things in the museum are always the same and they never move. i think it could mean that he wants a life that is different from his own, that is always the same and never changes to drastically. i also think that this could mean holden doesnt want things to be fun or wild he wants them to be inside the box and that holden is so used to dull and bored that this is how his life is not represented that he wants it to be boring.
It shows how Holden secretly wants everyone to be the same so no one would get judged for being different or being an outsider. Holden wants a life of simplicity, that way there would be no phonies or lies. Life would be simple and every one would be honest, nothing would go wrong. Holden wants a world where on one cares how much money you make. If life were simple he would not have failed almost all of his classes and have gotten kicked out of school. Holden would still have his brother and jane would be with him. All the complications in life make him depressed and sad.
In chapter 16 Holden seems to remember his child hood when he ties the girl’s skate and thinks about the museum of natural history. I think that this quote shows that Holden longs for a life filled with simplicity like others said on the blog. He wishes for the “phonies”, “hotshots”, and the “sunuvab---es” to be gone, although ironically Holden is what he defines as a “phony” himself. He has many complicated and direct opinions about life and the way people should be, but he doesn’t live by those standards that he creates. Holden’s life is filled with complicated and many stressful phases. The museum seems to symbolize a peaceful environment where reality doesn’t exist. It also symbolizes the simplicity and mellowness that Holden’s life continuously tends to lack. This new adult lifestyle that Holden has begun to take on isn’t working; he’s not responsible or mature enough to take it seriously.
The museum is where Holden is shielded from being an adult and being in reality. The museum almost takes him back to being a child with not but one care in the world around him. He forgets about school and telling his parents about “getting the ax”, the death of his brother, and the rest of the stressful thing that were bothering him; all of these things goes away and his childhood takes their place.
This is Kai.
This quote shows that Holden is very comfortable with a stable life. He likes the Museum because it stays the same; it has always been the same but whenever he visits it, it shows his change over time. When I read this part of the story, I was quickly reminded of the essay we wrote last year about an unchanging place and how it symbolizes our change. The Museum is an unchanging place for Holden and whenever he looks at it, he felt that he had changed and the Museum is almost like one of those things a child uses to watch their physical growth over time. Like a shirt for example, you can wear it for a while and one day when you go back to it, it does not fit you anymore. This also shows that Holden is very bothered by the inconsistency and complicity in his life. He reminisces about the times when he went on class trips to the Museum like Pheobe and longs for his past life; the good life. Holden is aimless in his life, he had no set goals. He transfers from school to school and lives in the moment. To Holden, whatever happens happens.I don't think he ever looks into the future and try to see what will become of himself because he is soo depressed and upset all the time that he cares about nothing more than what is happening in the moment. The Museum is a symbol of of what he wants in life. He wants to be in New York, with his siblings and mother whom he cares for dearly. He does not want to live an inconstant life away from his loved ones around a bunch of phoneys.
The quote represents the understanding Holden has for things. You can tell that holden likes to look at things from all angles. this represents the more emotional side of Holden
The quote has a metaphorical meaning too. It tells the museums sculptures are the only things that don't change periodically. they are the only thing that doesn't have the ability to change into a phony. Holden feels that a sculpture is the only thing he can count on other than his sister and Jane. he is also craving a life of simpleness, like when he asks sally to run away with him to the relaxing country side. Holden wants his life and not the screwed up one he is given.
It seems like a lot of the time life goes by too quickly for Holden. Everyone is always moving forward and changing constantly. Holden likes the security of the museum. The stability of the never changing glass cases and figures comfort him. He knows that the world is ever changing, and the people on the outside of those cases will be different every time they visit the museum, but knowing that what's inside will never change makes him like the museum.
Holden finds things depressing, and thinks about things that other people just don't think about. He said that the fact that everything was changing was not depressing like many other things, he couldn't really explain his feelings towards it.
This quote shows that Holden likes it when nothing changes drastically and he can live the low life. Holden would enjoy just being an average person who would come home every day and find everything the same and he could live his life relaxed. Holden doesn't want to be known as or thought as a hot shot movie star. Holden just wants to be a nobody.
I think Holden likes that the museum is always there. That the museum will never change. I think Holden's life is a bit out of control right now but the museum is very stable it will be the same tomorrow,and the next day, and the day after that. Who knows where Holden will stay tomorrow night? I think that is important to him. I think Holden is always switching schools and is hardly ever home because he goes to boarding school. Especially in the last few chapters i can tell why Holden likes the museum. Holden can always go to the museum it will never be too busy to talk to him or have a life of its own. It represents companionship which is very valuable to Holden.
I think this quote talks about the way holdens life is changing. the world around him changes when he flunkes out of school or when someone does something new for a change. when this happens, people start to go crazy, they can't make proper friends because he might not be there at the end of the term. he also losses any respect he would get from his family because he continualy flunks school. when he is in new york, he goes to the museam beacause it is one of the very few unchanging aspects of his life that don't change. it is a place were the only thing that is importante that changes is him. in his quote he says that it can by anything, even just that you saw a snowflake that was extra beautiful. everyone wants one place that they know will always be the same and holden can't even say that about his house. you can probably imagen how important this museam is to his sanity and small lack of hatred for life.
kwame
This quote shows how Holden wants everything to stay the same like the museum and not change. He does not want the world to change because there has only been bad changes in his life for example: Allies death getting kicked out of numerous schools not being able to see his parents and sister is very hard for him. I think that is why he does not want change because he is not familiar with good change, he never had good change in his life.
I think that this quote shows the emotions that Holden has been in taking through his resent experiences. It has a sense of the world being moving/turning on his shoulders. He hates that feeling. He just wants the world to slow down or stop. Like we’ve discussed before he started of wanting to be older. Now he’s realizing that what he earlier wanted was actually too much for him to take. Also staying “still” relative to being unnoticed which he seems to always choose to be. He seems to lie to a lot of people, but himself isn’t one of them. He calls a lot of people phonies. By that I think he always says that to refer to the people that do lie to themselves. He doesn’t want to be one of them.
What the quote reveals about Holden is that, he is saying that life is always changing and that for once its nice to see that something is always going to be the same. He really just wants a life that's simple. His life is complicated, always moving around from school to school, its always changing.
The significance of the observation is that Holden is a very deep guy and his observations on things is very different then to what you would think observations from a guy like him would be. It show that he almost wants to be like the figures in the glass and never be changing. That would certainly make his life a lot easier.
Summer
Holden is actually taking an interest in the museum and its arts. Its showing that he actually has a good or softer side of him that usually comes out when he is talking about Phoebe. Phoebe brings out the soft spots in Holden in a way. The significance of this observation of his is that he got really interested in the museum and doesn’t want anything to change about it.
-Brianna(:<3
This quote shows that Holden wants life to be simple and that he wants people to stay with him and not leave him. He wants life to be simple because right now his life is complicated for him. He is trying to find someone to have as a companion, he is fighting with his only friend, he is searching for his sister, and he is re-living a lot of memories(Allie,Jane,etc.). It also shows that he wants life and people to stay with him. I say this because he is always searching for someone new to be his friend. Someone to care for him and someone to be his friend or companion. He may find a friend but just like Jane or Sally, they may not end up being good enough or they end up needing to leave his life. He is saying that the objects at the museum do not change and he wants this to be the case for the people in his life. He does not want them to just be in his life for a short amount of time. He wants a friend to be with him for a long time without him having to always be searching for a new buddy.
What is significant about this observation is that readers can see the side that is showing Holden's true feelings of loneliness. He is confessing(or implying) to himself that he too is a phony.
-Ana
I think the quote reveals that Holden just wants a simple life where everything would stay happy and the same. Where horrible, new things wouldn't occur like Allis death, getting the ax from Pencey, and more. I think he feels he's growing up too fast, living in NYC by himself and wants everything to freeze so he can remember the moments of being young because he doesn't seem to feel that enthusiastic about growing up and doesn't have that much confidence in himself to succeed. In the quote when he says "nobody'd be different" i think it's significant because it shows how strongly he feels about people being characterized as a hot shot or phony, and it really drives him crazy seeing people like that and how he wants a world where everyone was equal so there wouldn't be as much opposing opinion or "I'm better than you" people.
This quote and seen shows a sense of wanting to learn. Even though he is failing his classes he still wants to learn but he wants to learn in different ways. He is also looking for his life to be more simpler. In the quote and in the museum everything is frozen. He wants to be able to pause his life and think about what he is going to say. Its like life is moving to fast for him and the way he keeps up is by making mistakes. This is a good quote and it shows how many different sides he has.
-James
I think when Holden talks about how everything in the museum stays the same no matter when you go, I think he brings that up because its the way he wants he's life to be. He talks about how the museum was the same from when he went on school trips when he was little to how it still the same when Phoebe goes. There has been a lot of changes that happened in Holden's life from moving from school to school, leaving his family, and Allie's death. The museum represents Holden's childhood when Allie and Phoebe were a big part of his life, when he saw them everyday, and was with his family.
Holden shows that he likes when everything stayed the same except him. He wants the world to revolve around him. It is also shown when he proclaims himself the main character in a story. Holden does it when imagining he shoots Maurice, the elevator boy. If everything had become still he would be able to do anything he wanted. Freedom in a sense, to drink, to drive, and to stay in school if he wanted to. With nobody being different they all would be the same. They would be what Holden imagines them to be. In that aspect everything would be free.
This was late due to a doctor's appointment upstate and my network went haywire due to a computer virus leaving me with no way to post my blog
Holden dislikes change. Pretty much what everyone else said… Holden wants simplicity in his life. He is unhappy with the constant changes (moving schools frequently, hanging around in the city without a stable living place to go back to without problems…) Not much to say here, everyone else pretty much has it.
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